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	<title>Comments on: BREAKING: Taxonomists are broke &amp; will do what they need to do for funding</title>
	<atom:link href="https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/</link>
	<description>Discovering biodiversity through taxonomy and photography</description>
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		<title>By: Morgan Jackson</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-401584</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Morgan Jackson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2015 23:27:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-401584</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Good for you! I think $10,000 is still a steal of a deal for a new species. I hope someone jumps on the opportunity and helps fund further research!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good for you! I think $10,000 is still a steal of a deal for a new species. I hope someone jumps on the opportunity and helps fund further research!</p>
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		<title>By: Robert C. Anderson, Ph.D.</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-401582</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Robert C. Anderson, Ph.D.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2015 23:20:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-401582</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Interesting blog!  Given that I&#039;m tired of seeing skilled taxonomists prostituting their important, unique and special talents, I&#039;ve increased the going price for this rare naming opportunity on eBay by more than 100%, to $10.000.00.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting blog!  Given that I&#8217;m tired of seeing skilled taxonomists prostituting their important, unique and special talents, I&#8217;ve increased the going price for this rare naming opportunity on eBay by more than 100%, to $10.000.00.</p>
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		<title>By: Simone Fattorini</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-401318</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Simone Fattorini]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2015 07:46:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-401318</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dear Morgan Jackson,
I&#039;m sure that if you will re-read the letter peacefully and without prejudice (as probably most of Nature&#039;s readers will read this paper), its true meaning will appear clear also to you.
Cheers,
Simone]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Morgan Jackson,<br />
I&#8217;m sure that if you will re-read the letter peacefully and without prejudice (as probably most of Nature&#8217;s readers will read this paper), its true meaning will appear clear also to you.<br />
Cheers,<br />
Simone</p>
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		<title>By: Morgan Jackson</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-401186</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Morgan Jackson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2015 00:41:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-401186</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi Simone,

I&#039;m sorry, but &quot;too short and badly written&quot; is hardly a convincing defence for what was an insulting article. It may have been submitted with the best of intentions, but if even the most empathetic readers (taxonomists, like myself) fail to see Dr. Strona&#039;s letter as anything but a(nother) slap in the face, then I highly doubt it will have any of the intended consequences on the rest of the scientific population. 

Nature reaches an audience many thousands of times larger than my measly little site, and so any objection to the original, as well as any defence/explanation of the author&#039;s intentions will go completely unheard by those who most need to read it. Sometimes trying to say something and failing is worse than saying nothing at all.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Simone,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sorry, but &#8220;too short and badly written&#8221; is hardly a convincing defence for what was an insulting article. It may have been submitted with the best of intentions, but if even the most empathetic readers (taxonomists, like myself) fail to see Dr. Strona&#8217;s letter as anything but a(nother) slap in the face, then I highly doubt it will have any of the intended consequences on the rest of the scientific population. </p>
<p>Nature reaches an audience many thousands of times larger than my measly little site, and so any objection to the original, as well as any defence/explanation of the author&#8217;s intentions will go completely unheard by those who most need to read it. Sometimes trying to say something and failing is worse than saying nothing at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Simone Fattorini</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-401082</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Simone Fattorini]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2015 18:43:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-401082</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dear Morgan D. Jackson,
I think you have completely misunderstood Strona&#039;s article. It seems that you have spent at lot of time in analyzing Strona&#039;s article word by word, but you misunderstood the main message, which is exactly the opposite of what you say.
It is possible that Strona&#039;s article was too short and badly written for an in-depth comprehension, but it is obvious that it was not an attack to taxonomists. On the contrary, it is a defence of taxonomy. Strona&#039;s aim was to attract the attention to the fact that taxonomists are disadvantaged in the academic arena because their work does not receive an appropriate consideration. Impact factors are frequently used as a measure to evaluate the quality of scientific works and hence play a certain role in determining a scientist&#039;s career. To illustrate how publishing in taxonomic journals can be wrongly penalising taxonomists, Strona cited the case of a new species of mammal that was described in a low-impact journal, although finding new mammals is an exceptional discovery.
As regards the case of Dr Kritsky, Strona just reported it as a demonstration of how the frustrating lack of funds for taxonomic studies can force a respected taxonomist to search for unusual sources of money. Kritsky&#039;s idea of selling species names is reported as paradigmatic example of the crisis of taxonomy, it is not attack to Kritsky.
The taxonomic crisis has generated a number of public appeals to invest more money in taxonomy. Such appeals have been sometimes perceived, by non-taxonomists, as merely boring litanies. Preconceptions that impede taxonomists to recognize even those that appreciate and defend them do not serve the taxonomic cause.
Cheers,
Simone Fattorini]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Morgan D. Jackson,<br />
I think you have completely misunderstood Strona&#8217;s article. It seems that you have spent at lot of time in analyzing Strona&#8217;s article word by word, but you misunderstood the main message, which is exactly the opposite of what you say.<br />
It is possible that Strona&#8217;s article was too short and badly written for an in-depth comprehension, but it is obvious that it was not an attack to taxonomists. On the contrary, it is a defence of taxonomy. Strona&#8217;s aim was to attract the attention to the fact that taxonomists are disadvantaged in the academic arena because their work does not receive an appropriate consideration. Impact factors are frequently used as a measure to evaluate the quality of scientific works and hence play a certain role in determining a scientist&#8217;s career. To illustrate how publishing in taxonomic journals can be wrongly penalising taxonomists, Strona cited the case of a new species of mammal that was described in a low-impact journal, although finding new mammals is an exceptional discovery.<br />
As regards the case of Dr Kritsky, Strona just reported it as a demonstration of how the frustrating lack of funds for taxonomic studies can force a respected taxonomist to search for unusual sources of money. Kritsky&#8217;s idea of selling species names is reported as paradigmatic example of the crisis of taxonomy, it is not attack to Kritsky.<br />
The taxonomic crisis has generated a number of public appeals to invest more money in taxonomy. Such appeals have been sometimes perceived, by non-taxonomists, as merely boring litanies. Preconceptions that impede taxonomists to recognize even those that appreciate and defend them do not serve the taxonomic cause.<br />
Cheers,<br />
Simone Fattorini</p>
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		<title>By: Walter Boeger</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-400968</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Walter Boeger]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2015 11:19:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-400968</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Morgan, it seems that we greatly misunderstood Dr. Strona&#039;s position in the letter, most likely influenced by a misleading title.  The text, itself was also not straightforward until the last paragraph.  HOWEVER, the point of your blog and the position of Dr. Strona are exactly the same.  Taxonomists are in trouble, especially the young, recently graduated ones.  These are though times to be a taxonomist, especially a traditional (morphology-based) one.   It is almost impossible to find a position in academics with a taxonomy-oriented training.
 
In part, this is due to the code itself, in my case the International Code for Zoological Nomenclature that does not require ecologists, molecular biologists (among others) and us to present the reference to the paper that proposed the cited species in their papers.  If this were done, we would likely increase the citation of our papers on taxonomy.   The code, however, was not created in a time in which citation was as valued as today. 
 
However, it is my feeling that this &quot;game&quot; of impact factor, especially those produced by biased methods, can not last forever since the cost to the science of biology may too high.  The number o factual citations of a paper has nothing to do with the quality of the work; it has to do with how popular that specific subject is during the next 2-4 years after publication.  The logic is very simple.  If a same lab is capable of publishing non-taxonomy papers in journals with high IF but cannot find journals with comparable IF for his/her manuscripts in taxonomy, the issue is clearly NOT the difference in quality, correct?  It is an unfair game.  Many of those journals with high IF in biology have eliminated taxonomy as a scope since it presumably yields low OFFICIAL citation counts!
 
Young professor trained in taxonomy, many of which I know (and that includes Dr Strona himself - he has many papers in basic taxonomy), are trying to survive in a severe environment that considers taxonomy a less-scientific field.  Many are obligated to switch into more popular areas in order to get a job.  That certainly increases the so-called taxonomic impediment to the point that the science of taxonomy may be lost for good in the near future and we, as science, will have to learn it all over again!  Fortunately, some countries, like Brazil, are lagging on this tendency and taxonomists are not under the same pressure.  Maybe these countries will represent the “refugia” for taxonomy when the rest of the world finally understands the damage of the present system of evaluation.  When WE actually understand that quality and popularity are NOT each other proxies.
 
Finally, sorry for misreading you text, Dr. Strona.  I am sure that the “soul” of your intended message was loss in editing and by an ambiguous title that suggested disapproval.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Morgan, it seems that we greatly misunderstood Dr. Strona&#8217;s position in the letter, most likely influenced by a misleading title.  The text, itself was also not straightforward until the last paragraph.  HOWEVER, the point of your blog and the position of Dr. Strona are exactly the same.  Taxonomists are in trouble, especially the young, recently graduated ones.  These are though times to be a taxonomist, especially a traditional (morphology-based) one.   It is almost impossible to find a position in academics with a taxonomy-oriented training.</p>
<p>In part, this is due to the code itself, in my case the International Code for Zoological Nomenclature that does not require ecologists, molecular biologists (among others) and us to present the reference to the paper that proposed the cited species in their papers.  If this were done, we would likely increase the citation of our papers on taxonomy.   The code, however, was not created in a time in which citation was as valued as today. </p>
<p>However, it is my feeling that this &#8220;game&#8221; of impact factor, especially those produced by biased methods, can not last forever since the cost to the science of biology may too high.  The number o factual citations of a paper has nothing to do with the quality of the work; it has to do with how popular that specific subject is during the next 2-4 years after publication.  The logic is very simple.  If a same lab is capable of publishing non-taxonomy papers in journals with high IF but cannot find journals with comparable IF for his/her manuscripts in taxonomy, the issue is clearly NOT the difference in quality, correct?  It is an unfair game.  Many of those journals with high IF in biology have eliminated taxonomy as a scope since it presumably yields low OFFICIAL citation counts!</p>
<p>Young professor trained in taxonomy, many of which I know (and that includes Dr Strona himself &#8211; he has many papers in basic taxonomy), are trying to survive in a severe environment that considers taxonomy a less-scientific field.  Many are obligated to switch into more popular areas in order to get a job.  That certainly increases the so-called taxonomic impediment to the point that the science of taxonomy may be lost for good in the near future and we, as science, will have to learn it all over again!  Fortunately, some countries, like Brazil, are lagging on this tendency and taxonomists are not under the same pressure.  Maybe these countries will represent the “refugia” for taxonomy when the rest of the world finally understands the damage of the present system of evaluation.  When WE actually understand that quality and popularity are NOT each other proxies.</p>
<p>Finally, sorry for misreading you text, Dr. Strona.  I am sure that the “soul” of your intended message was loss in editing and by an ambiguous title that suggested disapproval.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Walter Boeger</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-400791</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Walter Boeger]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Jul 2015 23:45:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-400791</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dr Kritsky is indeed an internationally known and greatly respected scientist on the taxonomy of Monogenoidea (Mongenea).  He was my major professor (before anybody goes after my name in the net).  He has a lot more than only 104 papers published and has been recognized as the scientist that described the largest number of species in this group at all times (more than 400) .  Despite his productivity and the quality of his studies, he has only few times actually received (if any) external funding for his research.  Not even from NSF.  He is a model scientist and deserves all the respect a person with his knowledge and professionalism should.  He has indeed &quot;sold&quot; the right to suggest specific epithets - about twice (for far less than the many thousands of dollars mentioned in the add).  From what I remember, all that huge amount of money was transformed into slides, coverslips, stains, and travel to collect.  But, anything justifies getting a letter in Nature, right?

I liked the text a lot.  I guess I will follow the suggestion and will &quot;stop prostituting our research to the highest bidder, publish in higher impact journals, and resign ourselves to a future void of funding, respect, or job security.&quot;  :-D]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dr Kritsky is indeed an internationally known and greatly respected scientist on the taxonomy of Monogenoidea (Mongenea).  He was my major professor (before anybody goes after my name in the net).  He has a lot more than only 104 papers published and has been recognized as the scientist that described the largest number of species in this group at all times (more than 400) .  Despite his productivity and the quality of his studies, he has only few times actually received (if any) external funding for his research.  Not even from NSF.  He is a model scientist and deserves all the respect a person with his knowledge and professionalism should.  He has indeed &#8220;sold&#8221; the right to suggest specific epithets &#8211; about twice (for far less than the many thousands of dollars mentioned in the add).  From what I remember, all that huge amount of money was transformed into slides, coverslips, stains, and travel to collect.  But, anything justifies getting a letter in Nature, right?</p>
<p>I liked the text a lot.  I guess I will follow the suggestion and will &#8220;stop prostituting our research to the highest bidder, publish in higher impact journals, and resign ourselves to a future void of funding, respect, or job security.&#8221;  😀</p>
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		<title>By: Gil Wizen</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-400401</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gil Wizen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Jul 2015 00:52:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-400401</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Excellent deduction, truly an outstanding article. I loved the detective work you did tracing the link between the listing-associated taxonomist and the author of the paper.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent deduction, truly an outstanding article. I loved the detective work you did tracing the link between the listing-associated taxonomist and the author of the paper.</p>
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		<title>By: Robby P</title>
		<link>https://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/2015/07/03/breaking-taxonomists-are-broke-will-do-what-they-need-to-do-for-funding/comment-page-1/#comment-400282</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Robby P]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Jul 2015 17:16:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.biodiversityinfocus.com/blog/?p=3300#comment-400282</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Fantastic.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fantastic.</p>
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